Forum Haiti : Des Idées et des Débats sur l'Avenir d'Haiti
Forum Haiti : Des Idées et des Débats sur l'Avenir d'Haiti
Forum Haiti : Des Idées et des Débats sur l'Avenir d'Haiti
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Forum Haiti : Des Idées et des Débats sur l'Avenir d'Haiti

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 ou fet ak kwaf ou ou se yon moun fou(schizophrenic)?

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AuteurMessage
OBSERVER KEEN
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Masculin
Nombre de messages : 966
Localisation : USA
Date d'inscription : 29/08/2006

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ou fet ak kwaf ou ou se yon moun fou(schizophrenic)? - Page 2 Empty
MessageSujet: ou fet ak kwaf ou ou se yon moun fou(schizophrenic)?   ou fet ak kwaf ou ou se yon moun fou(schizophrenic)? - Page 2 EmptyMer 17 Déc 2008 - 22:12

Rappel du premier message :

le mwen te piti ayiti, mwen tande yap pale de moun ki fet ak kwaf, setadi moun ki we bagay ke lot moun paka we. yo we baka, yo we lezanj, yo we mo, yo we bet kap vole nan syel ke moun odine paka we. avantye lide pase nan tet mwen sou sa, mwen pose tet mwen ti keksyon sa: eke moun ki fet ak kwaf la se pa yon moun ki schezophrenic ke nou pa arive pathalogize akoz de limitasyon kiltirel ak edikatif nou?
di mwen ki sa nou panse de sa, paske mwen panse sa tre posib?


Dernière édition par OBSERVER KEEN le Jeu 18 Déc 2008 - 13:30, édité 1 fois
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ou fet ak kwaf ou ou se yon moun fou(schizophrenic)? - Page 2 Empty
MessageSujet: Re: ou fet ak kwaf ou ou se yon moun fou(schizophrenic)?   ou fet ak kwaf ou ou se yon moun fou(schizophrenic)? - Page 2 EmptyVen 19 Déc 2008 - 16:51

elephant


Dernière édition par lent=slow le Lun 7 Sep 2009 - 11:30, édité 1 fois
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OBSERVER KEEN
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Masculin
Nombre de messages : 966
Localisation : USA
Date d'inscription : 29/08/2006

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ou fet ak kwaf ou ou se yon moun fou(schizophrenic)? - Page 2 Empty
MessageSujet: Re: ou fet ak kwaf ou ou se yon moun fou(schizophrenic)?   ou fet ak kwaf ou ou se yon moun fou(schizophrenic)? - Page 2 EmptyVen 19 Déc 2008 - 17:17

the lwa could be split personalities. I have noticed something that made me question the validity of lwa. more than a hundred people may have the same lwa at the same time, and they all may be saying different things. now either that there are no distinct or individual lwas or that lwas are in every point in the space-time continuum. so, saying that a lwa has left or entered a person would be linguistically meaningless if the same lwa were not bounded by physical space; or calling a particular lwa by certain name would also be meaningless.
what if lwa are alter-egos or split personalities that are encouraged to emerge by our culture? i have noticed that lwas have human character flaws like revengefuless and jealousy. now why would a spriritual being who cannot be hurt or deprived be jealous or revengeful unless those beings are not really true existential beings out there but psychological creations of our personal and cultural desires?
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OBSERVER KEEN
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Masculin
Nombre de messages : 966
Localisation : USA
Date d'inscription : 29/08/2006

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ou fet ak kwaf ou ou se yon moun fou(schizophrenic)? - Page 2 Empty
MessageSujet: Re: ou fet ak kwaf ou ou se yon moun fou(schizophrenic)?   ou fet ak kwaf ou ou se yon moun fou(schizophrenic)? - Page 2 EmptyVen 19 Déc 2008 - 17:25

"li tap monte yon etaje" is the key to what truly happened and the cause of what happened. many of our clothes in poor nations are overused. now, trying to reach to get something may put more tension on an already overused piece of clothing with overused snap. that alone can explain what happened as a result of an overused snap detached under duress(tension). your baby gazy was purely incidental as you have yourself believed.
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OBSERVER KEEN
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Masculin
Nombre de messages : 966
Localisation : USA
Date d'inscription : 29/08/2006

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ou fet ak kwaf ou ou se yon moun fou(schizophrenic)? - Page 2 Empty
MessageSujet: Re: ou fet ak kwaf ou ou se yon moun fou(schizophrenic)?   ou fet ak kwaf ou ou se yon moun fou(schizophrenic)? - Page 2 EmptyVen 19 Déc 2008 - 17:35

Anacreole my dear, I think that you have misunderstood me. I am not claiming in anyway that old people do not have wisdom, rather I am saying that in each stage of life, we all have a set of defense mechanisms. when we were babies, we cried because we knew that crying has a particular compulsory impact on our mothers that made them care for us; when we were teenagers, we displayed our prowess via physical activity because of insecurity and lack of identity, and so on. similarly, in old age when other faculties are not as sharp, we rely on past experiences as both invaluable assets and in some cases as defense mechanisms. it is a well known psychological fact that whenever we feel inadequate, we tend to overcompensate. old age is of form of physical and intellectual degeneration where social relevance diminishes, and old people are quite aware of that; but they also know that they are valued as wise characters. As all human beings who feel inadequate in other areas, old people will tend to overcompensate whatever highly valued characteristics they possess. hence comes the habit of counseling where sometimes it is relevant and other times it is irrelevant. So, in many cases where the older characters are giving advice whether they have saved you from incoming danger or other cases, these characters are sometimes right because they do have good intution as a result of long experience, and they also have strong relationships in the community where they may be warned of things in advance. Keep in mind that many of these old people in the countryside are often elders in some secret societies; but be mindful also that their counseling is at other times a result of overcompensation where they are trying to maintain some form of social relevance and importance. Remember that if someone saves you from imminent danger, you may become indebted to him or her. that is a great motivation for old people to give advice. In fact, I can hypothesize that people with means and status are more likely to be given advice by older people in the community than poorer people with lower status.
keep in kind that I am not devaluing old people, I am just trying to analyze some of their psycological underpinnings specific to particuar cultural frameworks.

I would never equate illiteracy with stupidity or education with intelligence. what i was saying in a nutshell is that many pathologies get different responses as a result of cultural and temporal framing. so, it could be that "fet akwaf" is a mild form of schizophrenia, but due to cultural framing is viewed as a paranormal ability since in our culture, we tend to give mysterious and transcendendal characteristics to things that we do not yet understand. In fact, that tendency makes it very hard for scientific adventuring.
just as speaking in tongues is actually a form of delirium but viewed as angelic contact in the evangelical cultural framework, fet-akwaf may be a mild form of schizophrenia particularly when we have observed that kids deemed to be "fet ak kwaf" are generally hyperactive.
Take for example, albinism. it is a genetic defect, yet it has different meanings in different culture. in pacific iislander cultures, albinos are revered as village wisemen and wisewomen, but in subharahan africa, they are more likely to be persecuted as witches.
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OBSERVER KEEN
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Masculin
Nombre de messages : 966
Localisation : USA
Date d'inscription : 29/08/2006

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Jeu de rôle:

ou fet ak kwaf ou ou se yon moun fou(schizophrenic)? - Page 2 Empty
MessageSujet: Re: ou fet ak kwaf ou ou se yon moun fou(schizophrenic)?   ou fet ak kwaf ou ou se yon moun fou(schizophrenic)? - Page 2 EmptyVen 19 Déc 2008 - 17:42

it is worth noting that superstition is not synonymous with stupidity. superstitious people are not stupid, they just tend to take a particular human tendency to the extreme; and that tendency is that humans have a propensity to prematurely link simultaneous events. in other words, humans tend to assume that simultaneous events either have the same origin or are for the same purpose or that one is the cause of the other. so superstition is an expression of intelligence without the rigor of intellectual curiosity.


Dernière édition par OBSERVER KEEN le Dim 21 Déc 2008 - 14:01, édité 1 fois
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Joel
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Masculin
Nombre de messages : 17230
Localisation : USA
Loisirs : Histoire
Date d'inscription : 24/08/2006

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ou fet ak kwaf ou ou se yon moun fou(schizophrenic)? - Page 2 Empty
MessageSujet: Re: ou fet ak kwaf ou ou se yon moun fou(schizophrenic)?   ou fet ak kwaf ou ou se yon moun fou(schizophrenic)? - Page 2 EmptySam 20 Déc 2008 - 10:40

OBSERVER KEEN a écrit:
the lwa could be split personalities. I have noticed something that made me question the validity of lwa. more than a hundred people may have the same lwa at the same time, and they all may be saying different things. now either that there are no distinct or individual lwas or that lwas are in every point in the space-time continuum. so, saying that a lwa has left or entered a person would be linguistically meaningless if the same lwa were not bounded by physical space; or calling a particular lwa by certain name would also be meaningless.
what if lwa are alter-egos or split personalities that are encouraged to emerge by our culture? i have noticed that lwas have human character flaws like revengefuless and jealousy. now why would a spriritual being who cannot be hurt or deprived be jealous or revengeful unless those beings are not really true existential beings out there but psychological creations of our personal and cultural desires?


Keen,

Doktè Louis Mars ,te fè yon etid ,sou fenomèn posesyon an ann Ayiti.
Louis Mars ,kòm nou ka konnen se pitit Jean Price Mars e misye se te yon psikyat.
Misye te eksplike ke posesyon lan dans Vodou an se te yon efè de bri inoptik ke tanbou yo ap fè tout lan nwit lan e jeneralman moun ki pran lwa yo se moun ki deja kwè ke yo ka pran lwa.
Se sa ki eksplike ke anpil Ewopeyen al asiste dans Vodou a e yo menm yo pa pran lwa.
Ou gen dwa jwenn menm moun sa yo ki lan sèvis Pankotis yo e yo tonbe ap pale langaj ,tou senpman paske yo kwè ke yo kapab ap pale langaj lan lè yo nan sèvis Pantkotis lan.
Se tankou gen moun yo ka inoptize ,genyen yo pa kapab;se pa bagay ki gen rapò ak relijyon.
Epitou se pa an konesè m ap pale,se jis yon opinyon
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